More from Wax Off
truebluebasher said: Who requested the most despicable reverse hostile cross national sickly song about world's #1 arsehole!
Think tbb should first warn the…
World Music... oops, I mean, music that is perhaps unfamiliar to western listeners because it's from underrepresented places..61
blackers said: A song fer Sussan.
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="
title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay…
Tunes8,398
lucky-al said: Likewise, freeride76. Will call in next time I'm down your way.
Botany Nerds Ahoy2,639
seeds
said:
Oh shit yeah, I’ve been there a couple of times. Once on school camp and once as a adult 25 years younger than now.
Show us your photos
2812
seeds
said:
Opti said “Anyone who reads your past comments will easily see why you’re not worth engaging in conversation.”
No numbn
All Things Religion Thread
5463
Optimist
said:
Where I live now is perfect…..but I’ve had better in the past.
Where in AUS would you live in you could take your pick?
17
freeride76
said:
You're always going to run the risk of a big flatty busting you or biting you off on light gear and bait hooks.
I wou
Fishing tips
1149
Supafreak
said:
This guy has broken his back in 2 places plus other injuries but this horrific fall didn’t break his spirit, such a amaz
The MTB Thread
315
only saw him once on a.b. sky which is same as indo posted, i put him onto it, the bit about yunipingu.
saw a bit more of the garma festival again and noticed his brother was m.c. and has inherited his dead brothers job.
been trying to find vid of jacinta price telling story of granny's bashing...can't find the one i saw but there is the same vid but edited out are what i said happened.
gunna keep looking but either it was a false account and embellished by a stirrer and deleted because of it??
either way i can't back up what i posted.
sounds real bad on my part, i watched it no bull.
the dv bit was correct and lets face it, 45yrs of the elites in canberra and it,s worse than ever in the isolated communities...why?
So, $365 million to spend on the voice. Ad campaigns, lawyers, limos, lavish dinners, glossy brochures, etc. etc. etc. and all for a non-binding voice to tell the Govt. the bleeding obvious things that they should already know. If Albo had a spine and a morsel of vision he could fly commercial instead of jetting around the globe in his personal half empty RAF jet and hand the millions saved straight to a worthy project. If only he could think outside the box and find a way to cut out all the bureaucracy, middlemen and nepotism and get some of the billions we spend on trying to bridge the gap straight to those who need it instead of into the pockets of elite white dudes in suits. So much waste when so many are in desperate need. Meanwhile, talk of raising the GST, now that is really going to help the bottom feeders. I will probably vote YES but can't help thinking there must be a better way. It seems like it's all about Albo's legacy.
totally old dog
if albo's proposal had an inkling of what you suggest, it would be an absolute no brainer...
probably with a number of yes-ers very close to 67 referendum... 90 odd percent!
but nah... no balls... no vision... no fukn idea...
I know citing jp will make me no friends... but she is 100% spot on in saying the 'yes' thingy is all about empowering the decades long blakfella 'elite' machine that got us into the current mess that is remote communities etc...
the cats that drove the bus to here, want another go...
no wonder much blackfella opposition seems to come from the remote regions
i saw a polly on news, the son of n.t, lnp bob katter who wants boot camps for young offenders, like a training facility for education skills and counselling for the toxic environments they have been brought up in.
6+mnths ago there was the alice springs expose on youth crime domestic violence etc etc, albo flew there for selfies and linda burnie. when he left (4hrs) an elder being interviewed said exactly what katter said + name and shame the adults who have corrupted these young picaninnies and gaol the parents and remove the kids to educate them.
the voice elite never responded and that elders interview was censored...disappeared,
linda burnie was shown at a.s. hospital intensive care unit where all 9 icu beds were taken by fnp women from domestic violence, 3 of them were on life support and all required extensive recovery and all were going to have lifetime disabilitys, linda was deeply traumatised and shakeing, close to tears.
about 3 mnths later another elder from kunnunurra said exactly the same, gaol and removal of kids and i think roeborne(?) elder said same a while later, 3x elders and the voice is tone deaf and mute.
and ppl want to vote yes...why? they don't listen.
i heard $370 million but hey whats 5mil diff compared to $30billion+/yr ...allegidely, but again no explanation from voice.
another thing i watched was bits of garma festival, i think day 3 there were speaches by fnp's and a fnp woman got up and gave a short explanation of what welcome to country ceremony was meant to be, the smokeing thingy.
she said only for baby born, death and certain ceremony's not footy and everything under the sun (my words) and chastised them for trivialiseing it and everyone gave her a big cheer and applause, kind of a weird response? either they were'nt listening or could'nt understand english?
again no comment from the voice.
@sameaswas, just in regards to your second last post;
Have you seen the documentary, 'In my Blood it Runs'?
Great doco that follows the life of a young indigenous boy.
When you're looking at positively changing the generational trauma, i think this is a better place to start in the healing process.
Looking through the eyes of a young fella who's living it.
Check it out if you get the chance. It's on various streaming services.
Haha!
Very good @etarip.
Voice Voters gotta Check yer News...no spoiler!
will look it up later tday.
my beef is with the ruleing elite for allowing this to happen and their egos and nepotism etc.
this is a power grab for profit.
allso we have laws against foreign inter ference in our politic and democracy yet the australian buisness council is pro voice and their members are donateing funds for yes 23.
you know who, rio tinto, kpmg, ety, pwc and every other foreign multinational mineing, hyrocarbon and financial crooks out there, all have offshore tax havens and are tax evaders and get away with it.
shows what a mercenary lot the yes elite are?
and why the bloody hell no media or constitutional lawyer has'nt gone boonta! about this!
hang on, think it's called buisness council of oz.
allso laws against pork barreling eg, $370mil for voice...zilch for no.
haha wonder if interviewer took them out of context. a mate of mine was asked about the voice,
meaning yes or no and he said .
"well i was gunna vote guy sebastian but when i saw him bully his invalid neighbours on cctv, stuff him i'm voteing johnny farnham instead" and the yes prole did'nt get the joke...hahaha
https://www.betootaadvocate.com/entertainment/liberals-terrified-an-ind…
Suss AEC Reffo Vote Paper
Before ya say anything...
Reminding tbb is neutral...that's why yer reading this!
AEC How to Vote in Reffo.
[Yes] = Proper Vote
[Y] = (May or not be counted)
[Tick] = (Half Proper Vote)...[_/] = Yes (vs) [ ./ ] = Maybe or n/a
Vote [Yes] Try not to [Tick] > Don't lazily mark [ Y ] or [ / ]
Do not mark [ Y ] [ / ] Your Vote may / will not Count...Ok!
...........................................................................................................................
[No] = Proper Vote
[N] = (Not really...You can Fuck Off)?
[X] = (Not accepted as a No Vote) Can be read as affirmative, Donkey or n/a
Only Vote [No] = means [No] = counts as [No]
Do not mark [N] or [X]
[X] May possibly count...but only if [NO] camp lodge objections between now & REFFO.
Of course tbb knows it sounds different or may advantage one or the other!
Noting AEC works for their masters...who ever feeds them...
In this case...The REFFO is bankrolling them to a record Enrollment Cash Splash.
This is not the only anomaly...tbb raised several Voice AEC disparities...eg: Direct Enrollment
Voters of all people should be awake to AEC Master's games.
Again...Whole reason tbb is sharing.
News just added a Poll
tbb just upgraded yer link : Is a [AEC] Reffo Paper Fair [94%] NO.
Who said things couldn't get worse for [YES] camp...
[AEC] : "For another half a $billion we can print a less than 50% suss batch of How 2 Votes!"
Any [YES] Victory will now likely be fought in Courts over the next 100 years.
Voting Paper is in today's News & [no] Director PM Abbott is onto it...read here...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12438845/Voice-referendum-tric…
as the article says, this is just that thing where X can be confusingly ambiguous, due to the machines that have read forms in the past.
Anyone who has filled in tax or gov't forms would have given this a passing thought, when you are meant, for example, to say you ARE from an English-speaking background, by marking the AFFIRMATIVE with an X.
Ticks mean yes, crosses can mean either, your tick may look like the ambiguous cross, so write the thing the form asks you to write. Yes or No. Good on them for making this clear so far in advance.
good one tbb, comes across as orwellian "doublethink" ...is basically the power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one's mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them.
yestrday on news a preschool teaching 4-5yr olds about white man came and shot aborigines etc etc and made them do crayon drawings of it!! took em home to show mum and dad.
not happy parents, some kids upset, big guilt trip laid on babes in preschool.
aborigine parent was appalled about it too.
yes camp proles corrupting innocents, makes you wonder what goes on in isolated communities preschools, we won't know cos they are gated secret enclaves.
as clear as mud.
What a complete scam, clearly just trying to help stack the odd's in the Yes camps favour.
Why not make is simple, two boxes Yes or No, mark the one you want.
The actual question itself is already misleading and plays up to the Yes vote by mixing in constitutional recognition with the voice. (two completely different issues)
“A Proposed Law: to alter the Constitution to recognise the First Peoples of Australia by establishing an Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice. Do you approve this proposed alteration?”
Even a Yes or No answer helps stack odds in the Yes camps favour as just choosing Yes has a psychological advantage, Yes is always seen as a positive No is not (any parent knows this)
If we were doing this properly you would have two clear options to tick the box you agreed with.
A. Would you like the constitution changed to give Aboriginal people a voice to parliament ?
B. Would you like the constitution to remain unchanged?
I think even if they went with that system Indo, they would still have to say 'an X won't be counted in either box, but a tick may be if clear enough', for the reasons I stated above. Wouldn't they?
I would have thought if computers are used that any mark in the box is a vote, be it a tick and x or just a line across the box
I agree, they should go that way. I guess the thinking is that some might mark 'X' to indicate they don't agree with a statement (which would register as a 'yes'). I don't really have an opinion, as long as they are clear about what the system is.
I think it would be best if they only accepted either Yes and No and not accepted ticks or crosses at all.
And make it clear at the voting centre and booths and on the paper.
Polling Place staff in 99.99% of cases are quickly able to ascertain the voter’s intention and if in doubt confer with each other and/or the numerous scrutinisers from each political party. So no need to worry your conspiracy filled head @info
Indo-demeaning says "If we were doing this properly you would have two clear options to tick the box you agreed with.
A. Would you like the constitution changed to give Aboriginal people a voice to parliament ?
B. Would you like the constitution to remain unchanged?"
Brilliant! Other than the fact A. and B. are basically the same question, it's even dumber than that. On it's wording, if a majority say Yes to Indo-dipshit's B. question it means no referendums, on anything, forever!
Further, he states recognition and the Voice are "two completely different issues" then completely ignores one of them in both his A. and B. questions. Genius!
They are one question, recognition by establishing a Voice, the splitting into two comes from those opposing a Voice, those seeking to confuse the issue, not the Uluru statement, not the AEC.
"Would you like to recognise FNP by denying them a Voice?" is not what they asked for, it's only the default position of those opposing the Voice, a position they themselves can't even seem to agree on. "We see you but fuck off if you want to have a say in the things that affect you". Nice.
It's not a multiple choice Q and A, it's yes or no, not yes but no or no but yes. Unworkable, confusing and a fucken stupid suggestion befitting only an:
A. Idiot
B. Racist
C. Right wing conservative who doesn't give a fuck about the country or FNP but only wishes to inflict a defeat on Albo and the ALP because they defeated the piece of shit former PM and his unelectable party in the 2022 election.
or maybe,
D. A combination of above.
Either we recognise them by giving them a Voice or we don't. They don't want one without the other, they didn't ask for that, and who could blame them, recognition without a Voice means fuck all, exactly the result the No side want.
Regarding the Yes or No, ticks and crosses hysteria, option D. above says;
"I would have thought if computers are used that any mark in the box is a vote, be it a tick and x or just a line across the box" and "I think it would be best if they only accepted either Yes and No and not accepted ticks or crosses at all."
Here's what Antony Green, Australia's foremost election expert said on twitter today;
"This morning I hear the AEC’s interpretation of ticks and crosses on referendum ballot papers has arisen. Nothing new here. Comes from long standing case law interpretation and is the same ruling as applied in 1999 and 1988 referendums." @AntonyGreenElec
Maybe leave these things to the experts, the law and the AEC Indo-freeloading.
“Either we recognise them by giving them a Voice or we don't. They don't want one without the other, they didn't ask for that, and who could blame them, recognition without a Voice means fuck all, exactly the result the No side want.”
Nail on head, Adam12! Thumbs up
1999 ~ Referendum Aboriginal / Migrant enrollment was very low.
2012 ~ 44% of Australians wouldn't be able to read a Ballot Paper...
2021 ~ Up to 50% of Oz > 70% of remote Aboriginals can't read the Reffo Ballot Paper
Oz has record Migrant % intake and record compulsory direct migrant enrollment
Oz currently has record Indigenous Vote Enrollments > (eg: Higher than Aboriginal School enrollment)
That sure don't add up!
Do the Maths...for > Record Compulsory Reffo / Aboriginal Direct Enrollment...
Most migrants + Aboriginals / Over Half of the Voters are illiterate & can't read the Reffo Ballot Paper
Up to 20% minority literate [YES] vs [NO] camps have indicated they're pissed & won't Vote in Reffo.
Majority of Voters have no idea what an Aboriginal or Reffo is but will decide Indigenous Status.
Yet as if by some miracle > 99% of [yes] [No] Ballots will be perfectly AEC compliant...(Shh!)
Q: Is it fair to mandate that illiterate majority of Australians run Oz Policy!
In other words : Compulsory Voting for majority illiterate populations is beyond comprehension!
How about...just sayin'
Only when Aussies think they can vote...then we let them enroll & Vote without influence! Sound Fair!
Saves the Govt bankrolling the AEC to rig more Votes each outing...getting mighty expensive!
I think i learnt in primary school that putting a cross in a box doesn't mean no.
You'd have to be a pretty special kind of stupid to think it did mean no, but then, we are talking about No voters.
Well if thats the case as you say, then why aren't they counting ballots marked with an X. ?????
From the AEC website. Hard to see what all the fuss is about, just follow the instructions
“When you receive a ballot paper at the referendum, you should write 'Yes' if you agree with this proposed change to the Constitution, or you should write 'No' if you do not agree.”
https://www.aec.gov.au/referendums/learn/the-question.html
I shouldn't need to to point out the obvious but the problem is votes that are also marked with a tick will count as Yes votes, but votes marked with a X will be not counted this is a big plus for the Yes vote, because nobody is going to tick the box wanting a No vote.
But most people that make an X would be voting No, so some No votes will be lost, this is a big disadvantage for the No vote, especially when you take into account the increase in Yes votes from accepting ticks.
Yeah sure there is some degree of argument that people may use an X for a yes vote, but lets be real thats very unlikely.
The point is if you want a fair democratic election process, you need to have a fair and consistent system, either count both or dont count either.
Of course this is very easily fixed, by having two boxes one for Yes one for NO.
But this is very unlikely to happen because they are clearly trying to stack the odds in the Yes votes favour, which with how the question is worded and Yes & No answer it is already stacked in the Yes votes favour.
A two option question without No or Yes answers would be much fairer.
And not mixing up the voice with constitutional recognition would also be much fairer.
If they want us to vote on constitutional recognition provide us a seperate question so Australian can decide, dont go trying to drag votes through for the voice by using recognition as the carrot.
BTW. Who knows how many people will use a tick or a cross, but truebluebasher shared some interesting stats above and those voters are the ones who might not read things or understand properly and use a tick or cross.
This disingenuous questioning of the fully independent and politically impartial Australian Electoral Commission is straight out of the Trump / far right playbook.
Anyone who thinks otherwise is either a pea-brained moronic imbecile with the cognitive abilities of a flea or a far right cultural war stooge of a mummy’s boy. Take your pick @info and if you vote no for one I’ll consider you have voted for both!!
Well, I hope y'all manage to weather this latest storm. Life sure does seem unfair and upsetting for anti-voicers.
What garbage, the very fact its being talked about now is important to ensure we dont have people be able to say, the results are wrong because X werent counted.
Imagine if the results were super close and this became a real issue.
Hopefully they sort it out beforehand and ensure we have fair democratic election and ensure we dont have issues like the USA has had
As far as I can tell Indo this is what the ballot will be, or similar. If people can't understand the simple concept of writing yes or no in a box surely we've got a bigger problem than ticks and crosses
https://www.aec.gov.au/referendums/vote/completing-the-ballot-paper.html
I'd imagine there is a fair amount of education going on in those groups tbb alluded to and those that are interested will know what to do.
If tbb's data is true then the "majority illiterate" voted in all of the previous governments we've had!
The YES, NO, X dilemma shows that Dutton has little faith in his supporters capability to string together two letters to form a word.
‘What garbage’ … what part of the first paragraph would that be?
‘It’s being talked about’ …. Apart from Dutton, Sky and the right who is talking about it?
‘They sort it out’ … do you mean the fully independent and politically impartial AEC? Do you seriously want them to listen to politicians like Dutton and act against their charter?
‘Hopefully they sort it out beforehand and ensure we have fair democratic election and ensure we dont have issues like the USA has had‘ …. As I said earlier straight out of the far right playbook where they believe in rules based order until they don’t see political power in it
"Well if thats the case as you say, then why aren't they counting ballots marked with an X. ????"
You haven't been able to use an 'X' to mark a referendum ballot paper since 1988 because 'X' is ambiguous, some people use it to mark Yes , some to mark No.
It is longstanding legal precedent,
It is not something invented for the Voice referendum to disenfranchise No voters, but that won't stop them from bitching about it like the whiny bitches they are.
Guaranteed SN's own loud whiny bitch who doesn't pay for a subscription will scream "it was rigged" if the Yes vote wins, he's already doing it.
Pretty much all media is talking about it, i heard it talked about on the ABC radio this morning.
It just makes complete sense to get it sorted out now, rather than run the risk of issue's latter.
Imagine if the Yes vote only just got up, No voters would have every right to whinge about this.
Why take the risk when its so easy to prevent by just providing a Yes and No box.
The aim should be to have the most fair and democratic system possible.
Let’s be honest here , majority of no voters will whinge regardless of the result .
had alook at that site, is that the actual reffo ballot paper?
if it is then no probs just write yes or no.
anybody got a copy of the real deal? so we can definitely all know what were talking about?
typical yes campaign tactics, ask a question get no answer or rants of insults.
show me the ballot form! and "keep it simple stupid" (old saying).
allso why no acknowladgement of my post of foreign interference by the b.c.a. and their foreign multinationals? this is serious stuff.
it's obvious the abc are not impartial.
stan grant this week said he left Q+A because he allways strived for open civil debate and it became obvious to him that was not happening the abc honcho's were deliberately setting it up to be adversary and agressive instead of civil and inclusive, he resigned in protest and fed up with management.
Oh FFS we have close elections all the Fking time and because we have a fully independent and politically impartial umpire (AEC) people/all voters should have total confidence in the outcome regardless of the result. FFS it’s the AEC solely responsible for the wording and rules to be used in the referendum.
It’s because of the AEC the most fair and democratic election is already guaranteed
Trumpism here already?
Undermine the process, create outrage, fearmongering, create division, win win even if you lose.
Will be interesting to see if its changed.
Fark, if someone cannot work that out, they shouldn't be voting.
show me (us) the ballot paper.
"Pretty much all media is talking about it, i heard it talked about on the ABC radio this morning."
That's because all of the media, owned by the right, including the IPA knobbled ABC, are seeking it's defeat because, like Dutton's LNP, they see a Voice defeat as an Albanese defeat and an unhinged chance to get back to some sort of electoral position they can win from. They don't give a fuck about FNP or the country, just power, power to rort and grift and look after the interests of their donor masters.
"Why take the risk when its so easy to prevent by just providing a Yes and No box."
"It just makes complete sense to get it sorted out now, rather than run the risk of issue's latter."
No it doesn't. Any change to the system the AEC uses to ask referendum questions would require legislative amendments to the Electoral Act. This would only give another opportunity for dicks like you and the LNP and the right wing owned media to bleat "They don't know what they are doing", "They are changing the rules", "It's not the way the courts have said it should be done", "They are trying to rig it". etc. And Dutton would oppose that as well.
The system and wording for referendums is established and has worked perfectly fine in the past two referendums. It is the one used by the apolitical AEC and has been arrived at by rule of law and careful consideration of these matters over thirty years ago.
The only thing that needs sorting out is you and those like you. Educate yourself or STFU.
Reckon it’s been here already for years but totally agree with the other comments you make
^^^
Oh FFS what is it about c**ts like you don’t get about the AEC being above politics and is totally absolutely categorically independent of all politicians politics and government. The AEC will issue the ballot papers according to their policies and procedures and not a minute beforehand
Bets are on how long this comment will stay up.
I reckon gone by the time I refresh my screen.
Its actually the complete opposite, its about preventing the possibility of Trumpism happening post election.